Your thoughts

[Narbol]

 Why do I get the feeling that you havnt actually studied the stuff you run around yelling? I just get a feeling that you're the of the type that goes around yelling YOU IGNORANT FOOLS! WHY CANT YOU SEE ITS TRUE! IM RIGHT YOU ARE WRONG! I FAIL TO EVEN CONSIDER OTHER INFORMATION I GET, BECAUSE THE FIRST ONE I READ IS TRUE!!!

That makes you an ignorant fool too, sadly. I would really suggest being rational with the stuff, and by rational I mean atleast try to comprehend with people. Your smashing makes you seem like an religions fanatic, which sure doesnt look good while claiming facts about science and history. Those two things happen to be such that very rarely give you absolute information about anything. World isnt one sided mate, and thus going around yelling Jihad on everyone who dont believe in conspiracy theories really takes your respect down in my eyes.

Chill mate, this conversation can really be handed in an sophisticated manner by DISCUSSION, not CLAIMING FACTS.

-N

[legintown]

Its like people saying that the color black isnt black, but more blue. The truth is that black is black, and the same truth is with science. You can't argue with science. I'm no fanatic, far from it, but when people fail to see the obvious, i get frustrated. I have studied so much of this, and please go read some of it yourself. I cant possibly remeber where i read each and every scientific fact. But like i've said before, and i'm saying it again now, go do some research of you own. Find a "red line", and make your own conclusion.

[Vix]

Posting in an american thread.

[Vix]

I'ma just throw in my two cents here.
I didn't watch the movie, because reading this is convincing enough for my brain to trigger the 'bs' alarm.

[Narbol]

So generally, you study alot of stuff and hold on to the conclusions you make? You didnt know that scientific facts CHANGE when new evidence or information is found? I've read history since something like 6 years old, starting with the basic stuff and moving on to the very detailed stuff written by top researchers in the world. Now that doesnt mean Im holding on so tight to my information that I wont change it if someone wants to discuss my views. Remember that in history fact is always the view on things, they are no absolute mathematic facts for example. I just really doubt your large scale studies, if you fail in very basic source critisism. I mean its ridiculous, even a guy who had never ever heard of the whole 9/11, George Bush or even America could propably understand that 99% of the stuff about it on the internet is manipulated to either way. You are clearly manipulated by the conspiracy side, while some other might have been manipulated with the terrorism side. Both sides have many very respected researchers and scientists on their sides, and I really think that if the thing would be simple to explain, most respected researchers had come to some atleast a little same conclusion about the events. But because of some retarded redneck americans going around yelling 'ITS DEM ALQAEDA, BOMB IRAQNISTAN' and stupid, 'educated' europeans going around yelling 'ITS DEM GOVERNMENTS, REVOLUZION!', we might never get any read answer to this kind of stuff.

I think you know very well what Im talking about, but refuse to believe in it, because your self consciousness would shatter if you werent right in this thing you have spent shitloads of time in.
-N

[legintown]

Well you seem to have drawn an awful lot of conslusions yourself. Since you have studies history so much as you say, I take it that by now you do know, that to understand history, you need not understand the events themselves, but the "why", the cause of the events.
So ok, about science. It is true that the facts of science do change in certain areas. Most of those changes are in the area of developement and new technology. However, it is hard to argue with the periodic table don't you think?
Concerning conclusions, this is actually something I encounter on a daily basis. I'm a mechanic, and I know quite alot about engines and such. However, I often stumble upon some dude that has begun to read about cars and/or educate himself in this area. These people often tend to claim something about an engine for example, how it works etc. If I then know, from personal experience, or from my education, that what the person says is wrong, I tell him that it is wrong. Why? Because I either know it because I've worked on for example an engine and how it functions, or have been told so by a person who has alot of experince in the field. That is why I know for a fact, that for example fuels of any kind, do not melt steel unless it is in a controlled fashion with the purpose of doing so. If I dont know about a certain scientific fact, I try to listen to a person who has great knowledge in this area, like professor Steven Jones has. He is not some conspiratory nut, he is a well respected college teacher. The last thing, which might even be the most important thing to ask is: What would the person or persons gain from their actions? In the view of professor Jones it would be ridicule, miscredit and so on. But he still puts an effort in it. Why? Because he is obviously convinced, on his background and knowledge as a professor, that something is wrong.
Concerning conspiracies, this always tends to be something as real as a marsian. Why is that? Are conspiracies impossible, or is it because it is so far away from our(western) way of thinking, that it would be our last option of belief? Is it because corruption is what we have fought against for so long, that we would not dare to think that it has infected our soceity once more?
To take the 9/11 events alone into perspective, I think it is, like when studying history, most important to ask the question "why?", and equally important, who has this affected. Who has benifited from this. I personaly think the answer is obvious, but I'll let you research for yourself this time, who has benifited from 9/11.

[Inphyy]

'Wall of text crits me for 10342 Letterdamage.'
'You yawn.'
'You fall asleep.'

Lamest thing I could come up with!

Interessting read really. Luckily I couldn't give a damn what happeneds in the world as long as I live a happy life. Call me an egoistic brad if you like.

[Fatalbone]

 Narbol you just attacked Leg just to prove your neutrality if you ask me I mean "fanatic1!!" was too much he just says according to his research which he worked really hard on planes can't floor towers. I haven't looked to researches but things like heat that melts steel must be constant. From your "neutrality" and way of think I am sure you are from a nordic country. Living in Turkey toug t me conspiracies can be true. Every five year someone has the high seats in national security, an important mafia leader, old sergeant and a MP dies in the same mysterious car incident. Well now singer creates a gang to tape rich people having sex with his own prostitues and blackmail. Goverment funded charity organization for disabled collects 20 thousand liras but spends 180 thousand liras just for an event.
 
But.. when you ask the question why it does not look like a conspiracy. What did they gain ? At least half of their goverment and whole world condemns them. They lost money. Whole world knows America is not stronger as it was. Only weapon dealers win but they win in every armed conflict you can't blame everything on them.

[Ahkailon]

Call me an egoistic brad if you like.

You egoistic brad! (brad? Give dictionary?)

[Palmar]

Allright, enough of this bullshit.

Everyone is entitled to his opinion, and it's an opinion and nothing more. Not one of you guys can fool anyone that you truly understand the events, the conspiracy theories, the science and the politics behind the happenings of 9/11. Arguing here is like banging your heads repeatedly into a brick wall. Cwave and Legin, both of you just pick out the evidence that supports your beliefs and completely ignore everything else. The larger part of people both in here, in USA and the world, seem to think the events of the day were not results of a conspiracy, but rather a well organized terrorist attack. These include stupid, smart, informed and uninformed people. Neither of you guys are capable of telling what's right, and what's wrong.

The world may be wrong, and it may be right, there is no telling really. Believe what you want, but don't try to force your opinions down the throat of others. No one can prove anything, and it will be a long time before we can surely say that we know what happened.

Actually Inphyy's got a point of view I like. Just don't give a shit. Let people think what they want, do what they want. Try to live your own life the way you like it, be it partying hard 24/7, getting rich, raising a family or whatever else.

[legintown]

Allright, enough of this bullshit.

Everyone is entitled to his opinion, and it's an opinion and nothing more. Not one of you guys can fool anyone that you truly understand the events, the conspiracy theories, the science and the politics behind the happenings of 9/11. Arguing here is like banging your heads repeatedly into a brick wall. Cwave and Legin, both of you just pick out the evidence that supports your beliefs and completely ignore everything else. The larger part of people both in here, in USA and the world, seem to think the events of the day were not results of a conspiracy, but rather a well organized terrorist attack. These include stupid, smart, informed and uninformed people. Neither of you guys are capable of telling what's right, and what's wrong.

The world may be wrong, and it may be right, there is no telling really. Believe what you want, but don't try to force your opinions down the throat of others. No one can prove anything, and it will be a long time before we can surely say that we know what happened.

Actually Inphyy's got a point of view I like. Just don't give a shit. Let people think what they want, do what they want. Try to live your own life the way you like it, be it partying hard 24/7, getting rich, raising a family or whatever else.

Well tbh I think I got the big picture of why 9/11 happened. Any1 that has read Orwells' 1949 shoudl have at least.
I also honestly think that the "Imphy approach" is what has brought us to this state that we are in. Not enough people care about whats going on anymore. People just want to live their lives in peace, and there is nothing wrong with that. But people must realize, that there are times where you need to fight back, and not necesarily violently. Some may think that I'm anti-american, but that is completely wrong. I actually think that the american constitution is the best thing ever written on a piece of paper. But I'm very much against fascist governments decieving their own poplulation, siding with big corporations and bankers for world conquest. If people where alot more educated, and more aware of our history, these kinds of things would never be possible. Taken from Jospeh Görbels book on propaganda(not exact quotes):
"It is easier to control a large amount of people then a small amount."
"A big lie is more credible than a small lie."
"If told enough times, a lie will be accapted as being true."
Think about this people. I'm not saying this because I want your vote, or for any kind of personal gain. I'm telling you these things because I'm deeply concerned about what this world is heading towards, and I truly believe that the governments of the largest nations in the world are controlled by a small group of people with their own personal agenda. Don't be ignorant, be sceptic, be open minded, study history, study the monitary system(very important) and your domestic and international laws.

[Grishnag]

OK, so you suggest that diesel oil melted the stell.

small fact planes dont fly on diesel fuel, kerezine(sp?) or petrolium however they do run/fly on

also kerezine/petrolium burns at a much higher temperature then diesel and the fact that diesel is hevier then kerezine/petrolium thats why they dont fly on diesel

[legintown]

I know, Cwave suggested that burning diesel oil from the generators contributed to the weakening of the steel. Modern commercial airplanes fly on what is called Jet-A, which has a maximum burning temperature of 980 degrees celcius, and this is under special conditions with maximum amount of air etc. Open air burning temperature is estimated around 250-320 degrees celcius.

[Smorisha]

Random site....debunking911.com...yeah really. Its funny that the constructers claim over and over agin that the building was made to withstand several impatcs of airplanes. Only 4-5 floors were hit by a plane. You think a plane could rip out over half of 47 steel clomuns? The fire could still not have melted the steel no matter how many times you say it. Jet-A has a max burning temperature of 980 degress celcius, and the steel metls somwhere around 1500 degress celcius. Ana that is the steel temperature, NOT the temperature that it is exposed to. Its ludacris...

Steel melts at at aprox 1564 degrees celsius but it takes something above 600 celsius and it will lose 50% of its basic abilities, knowing that building that was hit first got at least 10 flors above the plane crater do the maths. Plane didn't have to ripoff the steel construction, just to spray the fuel on it. for example if it was hit 5 flors lower it would collaps sooner due to more weight above the melting spot.
U cannot really compare this situation to any because it is quite specific building style (not used often in Europe) and the buildings that they mentioned in such theorycrafting aren't nowhere near size, shape and materials used aswell as construction type.

[Gaeios(Graxlos)]

I had to post more in this legendary post.

The thing about the melting steel is that the way the building collapses indicate that these 600-1000 degrees have appeared on ALL the floors since the building collapses fully and does not fall over. If this would have been a controlled demolition in would have taken days to make sure it wouldnt tip over on the demolition.

This was a perfect demolition and several firemen etc. told that they heard several explosions just before the collapse.

Im just saying that what happened was VERY unlikely, no matter if it is historically correct or propaganda or whatever.