So lets talk about cheese.

[kagemoth]

First of all i need to clarify to you guys what cheese is, since a few of u are
using the term incorrectly and this mindset needs to be altered.

Cheese: Finishing off your opponent with t1 units. This is 6 pool , a proxy in your
opponents base (proxy is short for proximity) with either a pylon or barracks and getting out
reapers or marines with very little travel time or 6 pool
spinecrawler(This is normally very rare though). 

I , and i know i'm not alone on this one , personally believe that cheese is as low
as u can go. It is a testament to ones skill to beat a player through skill and
strategey , which is what sc2 was made for , and to Cheese is the exact opposite.
It is the equivalent of saying "I can't play against you mid/late game SO if i can't
kill you within the first 7-8 min of the game i lose."

Now there is the argument that "one must addapt to the oppenent and counter" and
i am pretty sure noone will argue with that. However , the only way to counter cheese
is to switch to cheese and this is the part that makes me rage. The fact that i am
forced to rush out my spawning pool , zealot or whatever in order to counter the
sub-par intellectualy challenged fucktard who can't play against me if the match
were to pass the 8 min mark. That is to say if i even detect the incomming rush..
sumtimes i get suprised and then its just a rape fest.

Here is the an even more shit thing though. There is a stigma in the lower leagues
, though i'm sure it still occurs higher up , were "This is the stratagy everyone
uses". This statement was made true to me earlier on when i was playing 2s with Raph
and i detected the incoming cheese , got out a spinecrawler and a few lings but Raph
was a bit slower on that cause he went for a roachden. Loh and behold they own him
without any trouble and i say "Well , gotta love rushing" and then the one zerg
responds "Lol , this is what everone does." WTF... this is what everone does? Great.

Leaving out all the imbalances, like bioball or metal (or just anything terran lol)
if this game was MEANT to be played as a rush game, then gg , i eagerly awaited on
a game that turned into Wotlk in PvP.

To all of you who play this game as it should , i take my hat off to you sirs , and
to those of you who further enforce the cheese, well Gl hf , knowing that you probably
couldn't beat a 15 apm noob in bronse if the game lasts a bit longer than normal.

[Destro]

KAGEUMAD

[Gaeios(Graxlos)]

haha my favourite cheese in wc3 is towerrushing, although its usually almost impossible against good players.

[kagemoth]

haha my favourite cheese in wc3 is towerrushing, although its usually almost impossible against good players.

You actually have a favourite.

[Abyiss]

Yeh i got proxy pyloned and barreks yesterday, BUT this gave me a valuable lesson in base scouting properly and the next times this has happened, iv not been cheesed.

One you deflect a cheese strike, your opponent is easily over run. So you win outright as your economy is greater.

The thing im struggling with atm is, Void rays... and vikings, so its about the 6 min mark, i cant get lings past there wall, so tech up and expand.

Before i know whats going on 6 void rays/vikings come rolling in to win the game at the 9 min mark.


As a zerg, how can you prevent this. I normaly have 2 queens at main, wich is fine to keep 1-3 away but any more, then its GG and panic to pump out hydra/mutas/spore crawlers. but Mutas are expensive and get eaten by vikings.

Any advice?

[Gaeios(Graxlos)]

I haven't tried SC2 yet, but my point is that good players dont lose to cheese, and trying a cheese strat usually makes you very vulnerable.

[Sparrowhawk]

So you claim that if you win with tier 1 units, its cheese? Or win within 8 minutes its cheese?

[Grishnag]

i saw a vid once where a protoss got a mothership within 9 minutes im sure thats cheese to according to kage

[Gaeios(Graxlos)]

I remember almost losing the semifinal in a C&C tournament to an APC with engineers -.-
I made a nice come back!

[kagemoth]

So you claim that if you win with tier 1 units, its cheese? Or win within 8 minutes its cheese?

i saw a vid once where a protoss got a mothership within 9 minutes im sure thats cheese to according to kage

Don't try to be smart if u don't have anything to really say. You might notice , if u
actually read the post which you obviously did not , that i give a detailed list of what
cheese is.

[Abyiss]

LOL ENGINEER DROPS !!!! OLD SCHOOOOLLLL!!!!!


Fuck i remmeber that in Red Alert!!!!


KILL THE ENGINEER QUICK!!!! .. dam .. there goes my Obalisk

[Doomslay]

I dont play Sc2 and i didnt check what forum this was in, thought this was going to be a delightful bree conversation, its almost a foreign language if you've never played SC though - reading this, quite funny.

[Vorte]

Yeh i got proxy pyloned and barreks yesterday, BUT this gave me a valuable lesson in base scouting properly and the next times this has happened, iv not been cheesed.

One you deflect a cheese strike, your opponent is easily over run. So you win outright as your economy is greater.

The thing im struggling with atm is, Void rays... and vikings, so its about the 6 min mark, i cant get lings past there wall, so tech up and expand.

Before i know whats going on 6 void rays/vikings come rolling in to win the game at the 9 min mark.


As a zerg, how can you prevent this. I normaly have 2 queens at main, wich is fine to keep 1-3 away but any more, then its GG and panic to pump out hydra/mutas/spore crawlers. but Mutas are expensive and get eaten by vikings.

Any advice?

Hydralisks

[Sparrowhawk]

So you claim that if you win with tier 1 units, its cheese? Or win within 8 minutes its cheese?

i saw a vid once where a protoss got a mothership within 9 minutes im sure thats cheese to according to kage

Don't try to be smart if u don't have anything to really say. You might notice , if u
actually read the post which you obviously did not , that i give a detailed list of what
cheese is.

No, you gave narrow minded list of few cheeses with only information about what brings them together is that they are tier 1 and you win within 8 minutes.

If you gave detailed list you would say stuff like "Cheese is fast build order which, if failed, would give opponent massive lead for the rest of the game". Grish has all rights to be smart ass!

[Narw]

http://www.youtube.com/user/huskystarcraft?blend=1&ob=4#p/u/7/lgcfjTONnho

That's how you deal with cheese!